You cant go wrong with either a Citabria or a Grumman Tiger in your club. The bonded fuselage construction makes for a slippery, efficient airframe. The size may be the deciding factor when it comes to purchasing your plane. Its hard to beat a tandem seat aerobatic aircraft when it comes to fun. Unless you want to go off airport. It is such an OWT there's even a guy who makes satirical videos about it. Load carrying capability. The hierarchy of personal general aviation aircraft types has, over the years, come to be defined by certain mainstays. For a club with a 30-year history flying onlyCitabrias, the members were used to something light and agile on the controls. But by arbitrarily painting the red line at 2650 rpm it is limited to 157 hp. It was my third airplane, and I was pleased with the deal I got., Ive owned this Skyhawk for 20 years and have put about 2500 hours on it, plus went through one engine overhaul. Insurance for our 1979 Citabria (Model 7-ECA) was $870 in 89 and had risen to $2,195 when we sold it in 95, Greg said. Man erkennt eine AG-5B auch am T-frmigen Gashebel. In 1971, when American Aviation became Grumman American, the company identified a need for a four-seat aircraft. Former Flying Educators Club Secretary and Treasurer Greg Utley shares his thoughts on both aircraft. Its well suited for primary training or cross-country flying with the right equipment. All was in order etc, just don't know much about the plane. I don't think 150 nm is enough distance to justify flying. Nicest one Ive ever seen. ne cruised at around 115 mph and had about a 20-gallon fuel tank, Greg recalled. Ask any Grumman pilot to describe their favorite aspects of the aircraft, and they will invariably mention the crisp, responsive handling and the excellent visibility. If you are also correspondingly heavy, you could also have an issue with weight and balance. Predictably, more-powerful, lower-time engines and modernized avionics are the primary drivers behind higher prices. Insurance premiums went from over $3,000 in 2002 to over $6,000 in 2010. Id take a Tiger or a Cheetah over a 172, every day of the week. If you dont have an existing login on the Cessna 172 Club
There should be few problems with maintenance for either of these aircraft types. Its the
AboutPressCopyrightContact. Cheetahs are faster than Tigers. It all comes down to what your mission is. I think the only way I would chose the Traveller of the Gruman line was because I could get a good airframe and avionics package and upgrade to 180hp cheaper than I could buy a Tiger for, and I don't really see that happening. Gross weight was increased from the AA-5/AA-5A's 2,200 lb (1,000 kg) to 2,400 lb (1,100 kg) on the Tiger. , and whether the wing spar is metal or wood. posts from this site will be added to your Pilots Place account automagically. The main differences between the Piper Archer and Cessna 172 are: The Piper Archer has only one door on the right-hand side for access, whereas the Cessna 172 has two doors on each side of the aircraft. . Please head over to our new home at the Pilot s Place Forum. If you are looking for a good all-round airplane thats easy to fly, can carry passengers, and will do most of the things any private pilot wants, then the Cessna 172 should be perfect for you. 115kts and 120kts respectively? With a, fixed-pitch prop and fixed gear, its simple to operate. Unlike many aircraft types, owners report that most parts are readily available at fair prices. Accordingly, AA-5s are quick to convert a light nudge of the yoke into an instant change in attitude. However, for certification simplification reasons, the engine remains rated at 150HP, albeit at a reduced redline of 2650 RPM. Even with limited power (compared to 150 and 180 hp versions), and the absence of inverted fuel and oil, there were very few maneuvers appropriate for beginning aerobatic students that the airplane couldnt handle.. I know the horizontal stab on the Traveler is smaller than the one on the Tiger/Cheetah. The American Yankee Association is the original type club and holds regular events, including an annual convention. Cheetahs are around 850lbs. AA-5 Traveler & AA-5A Cheetah Competitive Comparison, AA-5B & AG-5B Tiger Competitive Comparison, Pilot Familiarization Program Instructors. Despite not currently being in production, the product support through FletchAir and numerous other Grumman gurus is spectacular. While the difference between the two is by no means huge, the 152 is the more economical option. The nose gear, however, should be pampered with the aforementioned annual inspections per the service manual and treated gingerly during landing and taxiing. The Tiger has the most reliable light aircraft engine ever designed. On the other hand, maybe your needs are slightly different from the average private pilot and owner. The most affordable single-engine planes. If your club is looking for an economical aircraft that can serve as a primary trainer and a solid cross-country platform. Perhaps because they are easy to fly, some pilots complain that both the Cessna 150 and the Cessna 172 are somewhat boring. I only have time in the AA1X series, the baby brother of the tiger, the canopy design I think is one of the better ones in GA, no issues, the free castor nose wheel was great for ground handling, nice shock absorbing and strong fiberglass mains, good fuel tank system, etc. Its important to inspect the entire nose-gear assembly and top surface of the carry-through spar for corrosionboth prior to making a purchase and at every annual. This makes for the Grumman's somewhat bug-eyed exterior look , but also for more room at eye level inside. Now Krish does have 3 other partners who own the airplane with him. It was largely a matter of economics, Greg said. Please contact the friendly folks at the Pilots Place for
Grumman Tiger Vs Cessna 150 - YouTube Grumman Tiger over taking Cessna 150 at + 50 kts. Otherwise I can take a photo of the for sale sign at the airport sometime. If so did he sell it after 2 or 3 years and get into a twin? The first time someone gets into an airplane like that and youre taxiing with a crosswind, you want to drag the brake to keep it going straight, Greg said. , The specs list the cruise speed at 139 knots, but Greg said the. The Cessna 172. Combined with a panoramic canopy, nimble handling, relatively modest prices and thriving owners groups, the resulting blend of strengths makes these Grummans intriguing options for new and experienced owners alike. Kinda dicey actually. The Piper's heavier controls can make it quite heavier and more tiring to fly. Its roll rate is faster than a Piper or Cessna. But by all means give it a try and see how you get on. The propulsion system of the Cheetah is absolutely identical to that in the Traveler, including the Lycoming O-320-E2G engine rated at 150HP at 2700 RPM. The Tiger has a published book cruise speed of 139 knots but owners generally plan on real-world speeds of 130 to 138 knots. Considering pre-flight, trip time, rides to and from airports, etc., it was faster driving on any trip less than about 200 miles. And, if you are doing aerobatics, you need parachutes that need to be repacked regularly, which would add a cost. Seriously, the acquisition cost is the least of his worries. The Aircraft Spotlight feature looks at an airplane type and evaluates it across six areas of particular interest to flying clubs and their members: Operating Cost, Maintenance, Insurability, Training, Cross-Country, and Fun Factor. What do I need to do? The sliding, glass-rich canopy can be flown partially open in flight, adding to the pilots unique experience in this series. Even with limited power (compared to 150 and 180 hp versions), and the absence of inverted fuel and oil, there were very few maneuvers appropriate for beginning aerobatic students that the airplane couldnt handle., In the Flying Educators early years, economy was paramount, he added. Jason McDowell. Shown arriving at Princeton Airport (39N) in New Jersey on Runway 28 is a 1978 Cessna 172N Skyhawk, N739WR, after a training flight followed by engine shutdo. The AA-5 family is largely devoid of any major ADs or technical issues. They're thrifty to run, simple to maintain, light on the controls and have great visibility with their sliding canopies. Still not fast enough to be a real cross country plane, imho. Similar four-seatGrummansinclude the 150-hp AA5 Traveler and AA5A Cheetah, and the 160-hp GA7 Cougar. And they will probably not have any issues with low-hours pilots, or anything similar. It will carry four people and luggage, and you have a wide choice, from completely new models to budget-priced much older ones. Come join us! The later versions produced in the 1990s and 2000s will cost a bit more with prices in the $75,000 to $100,000 range. We are a collective group of airline instructors, and pilots dedicated to all things aviation. That wood isn't 50 years old and it is glued to a steel frame including a roll cage cabin. Depends. Depending on how much exposure it has to the sun, it will need to be replaced generally about every 25 to 30 years. Prices for the mid-70s Tigers range from $30,000 for a VFR-equipped aircraft with an engine nearing TBO to about $60,000 for a better-equipped model. 157 hp is less than 5% more than the original 150 hp, and 5% is the fudge factor the FAA allows to avoid recertification. It continued to look good until it was sold. Cessna Cessna 172 Technical Specifications Exterior Exterior Height: 8 ft 8 in Wing Span: 35 ft 8 in Length: 26 ft 9 in Interior Cabin Volume: 55 cu ft Internal Baggage: 30 cu ft Occupancy Crew: 1 Passengers: 3 Operating Weights Max T/O Weight: 2400 Lb Max Landing Weight: 2400 Lb Operating Weight: 1666 Lb Empty Weight: 1454 Lb Even if you dont use the Citabria for aerobatics, there is something romantic about flying a taildragger with a stick particularly one that is light and responsive to control inputs. I am not very tall, and I cannot safely fly early Cessna 172s I need two cushions in order to reach the pedals and see outside clearly, and I once had one of them slip as I was about to land! Additionally, the castering nosewheel is a simpler and lighter design than those used in most Cessnas and Pipers. Krish discussed having to change some avionics, propeller, engine cowling, and after 300 hours of flying him and his partners also had to overhaul the 180hp engine, which cost a whopping $28,000. Answer: You wont need a lot of extra tuition, but a few hours with an instructor would really be a good idea. For not much more budget, the Tiger seems to work better on paper. Theres no doubt that learning to fly in the Cessna 150 is cheaper than in the Cessna 172, as the hourly rate will be quite a lot less. Copyright 2023 Flying Media. Enter your Username and Password to log in. The cost of ownership includes the original purchase price of the airplane, then you have you fixed cost like hangar, insurance etc. The Flying Educators did routine maintenance and annuals in-house with little difficulty, Greg said. In the year or two Greg was in the club while it operated the Citabria, there were no new members without prior tailwheel experience. The Tiger is halfway between a sport plane and a Cessna 172. Cessna 172. $37.09 + $15.58 shipping . Like any aerodynamically efficient airframe, proper speed management is important on approach and landing. Similar four-seat. Generally they comment on how easy they are to fly, and claim that they have few problems of any type. The Citabria is a derivative of the Aeronca Champ and was first produced in 1964 by Champion Aircraft Corporation. Picture . The Flying Educators isan equity clubfounded in 1962based at Ft. Lauderdale Executive Airport (KFXE). They are both basically a means to make aerial journeys, designed for touring or simply pleasure flying. Approachable Aircraft: Grumman AA-5 Series. This month we will compare the two aircraft the Flying Educators have operated in their 57-year history the Citabriaand theGrumman Tiger. It also has a faster speed and a better range. moved! Both of these aircraft are made by Cessna and are fairly similar when it comes to flying. Approximately half are ADS-B-compliant, and most have midtime engines. Enter your email and click on the I am a
Former Flying Educators Club Secretary and Treasurer Greg Utley shares his thoughts on both aircraft. But, hiding in the gaps between those segments, there are some less common types that offer an intriguing blend of qualities. He enjoys researching obscure aviation history and serves as a judge for the National Intercollegiate Flying Association. Topping the range is the AA-5B Tiger, which entered production as a 1975 model and differed from the Cheetah primarily by being equipped with the more powerful 180 hp Lycoming O-360. With full fuel, the payload is about 500 pounds or so plenty if its two people flying with luggage. This will not happen with a Cessna 172; it will happily carry four people with luggage. Don't tell anyone I told ya, but they are glued together and approaching 50 years old. Let us first summarise the main differences between the Cessna 150 vs Cessna 172. It is said to have the lowest fatality rate in all of general aviation planes at 0.56 per 100,000 flying hours. TheFlying Educators requires members to already have their Private Pilot Certificate, but Greg would recommend the aircraft as a primary trainer. At the end of the day, Greg noted that most members fly solo or with only one passenger and, for that reason, the airplane has to be fun to fly, and it is. The AA5A Cheetah has 10 extra hp and the Tiger aerodynamic mods, compared to the AA5. That said, the Citabria is a good aircraft to use for tailwheel training. There is a reason why so many people fly the Cessna 172, and why it is said to be the most popular aircraft ever produced. Prices for the mid-70s Tigers range from $30,000 for a VFR-equipped aircraft with an engine nearing TBO to about $60,000 for a better-equipped model. login you will see the new forum. Youre going to get more airspeed out of a Tiger than youre going to get out of most four-place aircraft in that category, Greg said. The 172 is basically the big sister to the 152-it's a nearly identical airframe, just larger in every dimension to hold four people. Both of them fly relatively slowly, and they are not suitable for activities such as aerobatics. So please dont just leap into a Cessna 172 with no experience and expect it to be just like the Cessna 150; it is different. It's kinda underpowered for what we were doing with it, luckily no one was heavy and the distances weren't far. Its roll rate is faster than a Piper or Cessna. A number of Cheetahs can be found equipped with the 180 hp O-360, which is available as an STC. We have moved! It continued to look good until it was sold. With a fuel burn at cruise of around 5 GPH, she does better than my Chevy S10. I must admit to being biased here. The Cessna 172 is a lot more powerful than the Cessna 150. 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